Denver Nuggets Big Board: Accumulative rankings

In the prior editions of our Big Board series Roundball Mining Company examined two separate factions of candidates for the Nuggets to select with the 20th pick in the 2012 NBA Draft. One group included players most pundits project as being available by the time the Nuggets first-round selection arrives, while the other consisted of players that could slip but will most likely be off the board by the time the 20th pick rolls around. With the Draft now less than a week away we’ve decided to compile a list of the Top 10 players featured in all of our Big Board articles to make a single, comprehensive big board that ranks the best player available for the Nuggets to chose with its first-round selection.

(A brief FYI: All of the players mentioned below are guys I like and/or believe would be justifiable selections at 20. Though they are rated 1-10, there is an extremely small margin of preference I have between them. Two players featured in our Outliers Big Board — Terrence Ross and Kendall Marshall — have been left off this list entirely as I firmly believe they will be gone before the Nuggets select; however, if for some reason they are available I would fully support the front office selecting either of those players as they are tremendous talents. This list is subject to change.)

1. Perry Jones // Baylor // Power Forward

Ruminating about who would take the No. 1 spot on this list was a difficult task. I love the three players right below Jones but in the end (and after a short deliberation with some of my Twitter followers) it was determined that at 20, Jones’ upside far outweighed his risks.

While he may never fulfill the lofty expectations bestowed upon him by the media, Jones is still one of the most talented and versatile players in this draft. In the right situation with limited pressure (i.e. Denver) he could flourish and finally become the player everyone knows he can be. The great thing about this pick is that no matter what, Denver will get a contributor. At worse, his passiveness gets the best of him and he becomes a solid bench guy who can match up with some of the premier power forwards in the league; at best, he’s a potential franchise changer.

This is the perfect opportunity for the Nuggets to take a flyer on a guy who could end up being special.

2. Andrew Nicholson // St. Bonaventure // Power Forward

Up until the final minute of composing this Big Board I had Nicholson as the No. 1 rated prospect for the Nuggets. The gap between him and Jones is significantly small. In fact, you could swap either of these guys out for each other and I’d be perfectly content. Because Jones is just teeming with upside Nicholson takes a backseat, but don’t get it twisted, the Monster Man from St. Bonaventure has all sorts of potential himself.

If you’re still skeptical about RMC’s signature prospect for this year, I’d urge you to take a look at this article by Kyle Nelson of Draft Express which ranks the top big men in the Draft based on their statistical production this past year. Of note, Nicholson leads the pack in points per 40 minutes pace adjusted and is second in PER behind only… Anthony Davis.

3. Royce White // Iowa State // Power Forward

Although still active, White’s anxiety concerns have seriously disintegrated in recent weeks. He’s been coping well with flying city to city and as a result has reportedly earned himself a promise from a team slated to pick in the first round. Rumors have it Danny Ainge and the Celtics are the suspects but don’t count on White making it past the Nuggets as a guarantee.

It’s a well-known fact that teams don’t work out players arbitrarily. Prior to canceling last week, White was scheduled to showcase his repertoire in front of Masai Ujiri and the Nuggets brass in Denver. Clearly he’s on their radar, however skipping his Nuggets workout could jeopardize his chances of being selected at 20.

White is still one of the most interesting players in the Draft and someone I could definitely see in a Nuggets uniform starting as early as this summer.

4. Jared Sullinger // Ohio State // Power Forward

The Nuggets are going to have an incredibly difficult decision to make if Sullinger happens to slide on Draft day. With guys like White and Nicholson seemingly scheduled to hang around for a while, the team will have to face the dilemma of choosing between several players with their fare share of strengths and weaknesses. The real question the Nuggets must answer in regards to Sullinger is how much stock they put into his recent injury report. If they deem his body a legitimate concern, he’ll continue to fall; if they think the news has been overblown, it will be excruciatingly tough to pass on such a skilled offensive talent.

5. Terrence Jones // Kentucky // Power Forward

In all likelihood Jones will be gone by the time the Nuggets select. His question marks aren’t quite as glaring as the ones Sullinger and Jones posses. Additionally, his talent is through the roof. However, considering the minute possibility he does fall to 20, the Nuggets would again face a perplexing predicament.

Will Jones have a better career than White or Nicholson? What’s his true position? (He’s really stuck between a three and four.) Does he have the potential to be special and not just a regular starter in the league? These are all questions the Nuggets will have to weigh on Draft night.

6. Quincy Miller // Baylor // Small Forward

Miller is one of the toughest guys in the Draft to gauge. He’s always been highly thought of throughout his career but his lone year at Baylor was enigmatic, to say the least.

The problem Denver faces with Miller is determining how much stock they’ll put into a limited sample size of confusing Baylor footage while melding that with tape from his high school days. They know Miller is still young, extremely talented and has an enormous amount of upside, but is he still the same player he was his junior year in high school? Remember, because of an ACL injury, Miller was sidelined his entire senior year. While he played OK at Baylor, the athleticism that had defined him up to that point was clearly missing.

Is he ever going to regain that explosiveness that left scouts salivating, or will his fragile frame disallow a proper recovery? The fact is: It’s been nearly two full years since his injury and yet the doubts are still prevalent. Whether he’ll ever be considerably better than Gallinari, Chandler or Hamilton seems questionable.

7. Will Barton // Memphis // Shooting Guard

At this point the prospects being to taper off. While I personally love Barton, even I know that taking him with the 20th pick might be a bit of a reach considering who will likely be on the board at that point in time. One thing is clear, however: Barton is still a very underrated prospect in this draft. If the Nuggets could somehow maneuver themselves into another late first-round pick, Barton would be a fantastic choice.

If for some reason Ujiri did in fact pick Barton at 20, it would be a surprisingly satisfactory selection from my standpoint as it would confirm that Ujiri — one of the best general managers in the NBA — saw exactly what I did in Barton all this time.

8. Moe Harkless // St. John’s // Small Forward

If I had to chose a sleeper pick, this would be it. Judging by Ujiri’s interest in Kenneth Faried, Tobias Harris and Iman Shumpert last year, Harkless seems to fit the bill for the type of players Ujiri seeks out: guys with tons of upside, versatility, who play defense and usually do one or two things really well.

Harkless is one of the youngest players in this Draft yet has one of the most NBA-ready bodies and simply looks like he belongs at the next level. His game is smooth and resourceful, but he’s relentless and energetic at the same time.

Though the Nuggets have a plethora of wings under contract heading into next year, Ujiri knows the first round is all about potential and if there’s one guy that has it, it’s Harkless.

9. Tony Wroten Jr. // Washington // Point Guard

Another luxury pick, Wroten is perhaps the most dynamic conundrum the NBA Draft has seen in years. He can’t shoot worth a lick, he’s hard-headed, drives the lane like an out-of-control Lamborghini and makes more boneheaded decisions than he does intelligent ones, however there’s no denying the near-infinite amount of potential he possesses as a point guard.

Like Perry Jones, this could be a pick that doesn’t pay off until three years down the line, but when it does the Nuggets could be looking at a star player. Adding Wroten may create controversy and an uncertainty at the point guard position but if Ujiri was truly confident in Wroten it’s not like the possibility of having two All-Star caliber point guards on his roster would cause him to lose sleep.

10. Draymond Green // Michigan // Power Forward

I probably like Green more than most. He played power forward in college but I think in the right situation he could end up being a two guard in the NBA.

The biggest obstacle for Green will be getting in prime physical condition. He’s always been slightly overweight and therefore unable to keep up with some of the quicker guards at the collegiate level but he looked excellent at the Combine and appears to have turned over a new leaf with his fitness routine.

Like Barton, I don’t see the Nuggets selecting Green at 20, but if they could work out a deal to land another late first-round pick, there won’t be many players better than Green to select at that point.

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Kalen Deremo

Kalen was born in Durango, CO, in 1988 and graduated from Metropolitan State University of Denver in 2013 with a degree in journalism. He's now an itinerant hoping to travel as much as possible before eventually succumbing to the "real world." Aside from writing Kalen likes movies, music, spicy food and the great outdoors. Edward Abbey is his current idol.

Latest posts by Kalen Deremo (see all)

  • Landry

    Personally I would put number 1 prospect for the Denver Nuggets would be Michael Kidd-Gilchrist. Frankly our small forward position needs to be a lock-down defender after dealing with culture of No Defense and all offense. Gallinari’s great and all but if he’s on the floor with Kenneth and McGee, I’d rather have the rookie guarding guys like Lebron, Gay, Melo or any small forward while having Gallo play the post and stretch 4’s against guys like Dirk, Pau, and Bosh because he is a Legit 6’10” and this creates a cross match in transition anyways, which the nuggs are masters of.

    So in my opinion, the Nuggs number 1 pick should be somebody whom could draft outperform our strongest position of SF. Hence my dream pick is going with defense and a championship mentality. So MKG is the only player whom fits this category of being able to outperform Gallo, Chandler and even Brewer with his basketball skills and intensity because he’ll have to outwork the energy hydrant that is Corey Brewer to even smell playing time and that is just plain hard.

    • Bryan

      Kidd-Gilchrist is a lottery pick. This is a list of guys that might be there at 20. They’d have to trade up to get him.

      • Landry

        True but we have trade assets and Gallinari is still a high value player because I don’t like his will to win as much as MKG because of his flops. His flops costs us games because he doesn’t take charges at the basket but rather attempts on the perimeter for open dunks instead of a contested lay-up/post move.

  • DAN

    Looks good. Will be interesting to see how this plays out. There doesn’t seem to be much agreement on the mocks for picks 10-25.

  • coxy

    gotta trade for one of houstens picks whilst keeping 20. say chandler for 14 or 16 and then combine 38 and 50 for chicago or warriors 29 or 30. then select perry jones nicholson and quincy miller/john jenkins

    • Greg

      I actually like that idea. I don’t know if Houston would take Chandler for 14 or 16, let alone Jones still being available. However, Nicholson would be there at 20 and if the Bulls took the 38,50 deal, Jenkins would probably be there at 30 (probably not Miller though). Nice idea overall, I would love this draft. Gives us potential and immediate shooting help.

    • Guy

      I like your thinking also, although I would try and get Ross with Houston’s pick. I’ve been reluctant to go with PJ3 but if they could get Ross at #14 or #16 I’d pick him over Nicholson at #20. Packaging the two 2nd round picks I’d go with Miller, Sullinger or the best point guard still on the board in that order although if the Nuggets added a little more to that package they might be able to trade with Boston and still draft Nicholson which would be my perfect (and completely doable) draft.

  • steve

    Nice work. Honestly, the only player i’m not a fan of is Q.Miller. I know he was a huge recruit in HS, but i just didnt care for his game at Baylor. He just seems like a late 1st rd that someone will take a flyer on him just because of how he performed 2 years ago and not in college.

  • Erlingur Gretar

    What do you think our chances of getting the Bobcats #2 pick are? Is there any legit scenario where that might happen, or would we have to give up too much?

    • Greg

      Unless we want to give up Ty, AAA, Gallo, Faried and our 1st round pick… In short no!

    • Kalen

      The Nuggets would have to give up a lot; something like two starters, a bench player and their own first rounder — maybe even a future first rounder as well. With no Durants or Wades available, its just not worth it.

      • Erlingur Gretar

        Yeah, I agree. That would be way too steep.

        • Landry

          Not if you go after Cleveland’s 4th pick because they don’t get Bradley Beal. Trade them Gallinari, our best offensive player on the best offensive team in the league to a team that needs offense. In addition they can have his contract for 4 years and we give up a big in Moz/Kouf/Bird and a second late first rounder for MKG.

          Cleveland has an effective scorer/passer and we develop a culture of athletic fiendy defense. Having 3 bodies to throw at every team with both Chandler and Brewer running on rotation and cut putting defense first and foremost for playing time. This is a championship strategy with Faried, AAA and McGee defending with an elite bench. With a defense first mentality we can better execute our man to man rather than an noneffective charge based defense that Houston has shown off.

          • Zack

            I don’t think MKG is worth trading Gallo, Kouf or Moz (no way they take Bird off our hands) and the #20 pick.

            Also, I don’t think there’s any way Charlotte listens to that offer. I would think in their opinion, the #2 pick is worth more than that.

            I like the idea of trading Wilson to get another mid first round pick, but I’m not sure who would do that. The Raps would be ideal because they wanted him but Chandler for #8 is unreasonable I think.

  • zebort

    Being that Masai always seems to pull an international player out of his back pocket at the last minute for the second round, are there any international gems that he might be looking at? Someone like Joseph Franch (Spain). I know Pablo Prigioni (35) may be a too old.

    • Kalen

      I’m not as familiar with international prospects but I know of a few guys who may be worth taking a look at. I’ll have a post in a few days about it.

  • Bryan

    I read the Draft Express article and it actually raised some concerns. His offensive production is nice but he’s from a small school and so wasn’t going up against elite competition.

    He was in the bottom quarter for offensive rebounds and for turnovers per game. That concerns me, especially since he wasn’t facing elite competition.

    I’m curious as to what you have against Moultrie and Teague both have been mocked to the Nuggets. Especially, when you have Green on your list. Not sure how an out of shape guy in college would handle being in an uptempo offense at altitude. My gut says probably not well.

    • Manimal

      Marquis Teague is in the category of wroten and Quincy miller as high potential guys who could be a lottery pick if they played another year. Personally I think Teague should be on your big board since he would fit our system well

    • Kalen

      You seem to be focusing a bit more on the negatives than the positives. Nicholson ranked in the top half of most of those categories, and I think top 10 in about four or five. Putting so much stock into offensive rebounds and turnovers over things like points, blocks, total rebounds, field goal percentage, etc., could force you into having an erroneous perception about a guy.

      Read my Outliers Big Board for my take on Moultrie. As for Teague, do you really think he’s going to be that much better than Lawson? I sure don’t. I watched him many times last year and was never impressed. He’s almost a mirror image of Lawson in terms of his skill set, yet he’s more reckless. I like Marshall ten times more than Teague. If we were talking about a point guard who could one day morph into one of the best in the league, I wouldn’t hesitate in advocating for the Nuggets to take him; however I don’t think Teague is that type of guy.

      • Poz_303

        Kalen, I would have to disagree with your take on Teague, but only because I dont view him as a future Lawson replacement but a guy who could run a similar offense off the bench. However, I think picking him at 20 would be a reach so he certainly is not my top choice I dont think we should be looking for a Lawson replacement for a few years, as such Teague would be a nice back-up prospect.

        I agree with you with regards to Nicholson and PJIII. I think these two guys are the top tier picks for the Nuggets at 20. PJIII has huge upside and Nicholson is probably the best post player available (with outside shooting ability). I would be tempted to throw in Moultrie in this tier if he happened to fall to 20. Would be a tough choice between Moultrie and Nicholson. I think I might even lean more towards Nicholson but Moultrie may have slightly more upside.

        Tier 1: PJIII, Nicholson, Moultire

        Tier 2: Sullinger, White, Jones

        Tier 3: Harkless, Barton

        Tier 4: T. Taylor, Teague, Wrotten

        I left out Q. Miller, I didnt follow him in HS but judging from his college play, he has a low release and little elevation on his jumpshot. I dont think it translates well to the NBA. Simply my opinion but thats my take.

        • asdqqq

          Interesting how different people see things. Here’s how I have the tiers for guys potentially available at 20 (I don’t have Terrence Jones in here because I don’t think he makes it to 20):

          Tier 1: Teague, Marshall, Wroten

          Tier 2: Doron Lamb, White, Barton, Miller, Sullinger

          Tier 3: Nicholson, Perry Jones III, Jenkins, Jeff Taylor, Fab Melo

          • Poz_303

            I guess we are all influenced by what we perceive as ‘need’ for the Nuggets. Looking at both our tiers, seems like you are leaning towards a PG while I would prefer a PF at 20.

            I would say PJIII has more upside than Teague but Marshall should be a Tier 1 PG and Wrotten probably has as much upside as PJIII but has such a poor shot I cant put him in my top tier.

            If Marshall is available at 20 I would not be upset to see the Nuggets draft him but still feel Teague at 20 might be a reach if PJIII is available.

            • asdqqq

              I’m trying to take need out of it. I don’t think the Nuggets need a PG. They will probably resign Andre, especially if they don’t draft one. And Karl doesn’t play rookies anyways, so it’s extra silly for the Nuggets to draft for need.

              I think generally teams in the draft overemphasize size, so when you get around to pick 20, the best prospects left are generally either wings and PGs or undersized bigs.

              Moultrie and Nicholson are neither. Moultrie seems to me like your generic athletic big. He doesn’t seem to be particularly good at anything. Nicholson is just a crazy prospect. He apparantly has all these tools that he never used until the last 10 games of his college career. He had tons of effort and motor questions and never shot from distance until those last 10 games. Could he be good? Sure. But he’s a major risk. And his upside is still probably not going to reach perrenial all star level. I’d love him as a second round pick, but I just think there are better prospects around at 20.

              Sullinger and White are undersized, so it makes sense that they could drop to 20. However, they both have some serious questions that guys like Marshall and Teague don’t have. And neither of them has as high a ceiling as Wroten.

              • Kalen

                The way you describe Nicholson is way different than the Nicholson I know. You sure we’re talking about the same guy? I’ve never heard any problems about him regarding motor and effort and I’ve read almost everything there is to read about him. You also mention in a comment below how bigs are supposed to get better with time — Nicholson, more than any prospect in this draft, was the model of that theory. He improved every year both statistically and in terms of his skill set.

              • asdqqq

                Excerpts from a number of different ESPN scouting reports prior to his senior season:

                “The questions with Nicholson center on motor and drive. He can be an indifferent rebounder and defender, and he lacks toughness at times.”
                “Scouts haven’t really wanted to like him. He has put up points, but his lack of rebounding and overall basketball IQ had most scared to death.”
                “The Bad: Scouts have questioned his toughness and commitment over the years. He’s been a bit of an indifferent rebounder and defender in the past.”

                I’m guessing all the stuff you have read on him has been based solely on his senior season.

              • Kalen

                No I did read that, actually. I just never put any stock into it because every time I watched him I never got that feeling, at all. In fact I got quite the opposite impression.

              • Asdqqq

                If you had read that, then why did you say this?
                “I’ve never heard any problems about him regarding motor and effort and I’ve read almost everything there is to read about him.”
                Just confused.

      • asdqqq

        I don’t understand this reasoning on Teague. None of these guys on your big board has much of a chance of morphing into one of the top guys at his position in the league. That’s why they might be available at 20.

        I agree that Teague is a lot like Lawson. What’s wrong with that? Would you put all of these guys above Lawson if he were in this draft? Teague has a very high floor. He’s going to be at least a quality backup PG in the NBA. And there really aren’t a lot of those guys. A lot of teams are starting guys who really are only quality backup level players. So that’s a great asset to have. And his upside is another Ty Lawson, one of the top 10 PGs in the league. That’s as high as any of the guys on your list. So I just don’t understand ranking someone with the same upside and a much higher floor below guys with much lower floors and much lower probability of hitting their ceiling.

        • Kalen

          We just disagree on Teague. If he was really that good, he’d be going much higher in this draft especially considering how weak it is at point guard. Teague has a high ceiling, I agree, but you can’t just ignore his issues at the same time. Also, this is probably the best era of point guards the NBA has ever seen. Even if he reaches his ceiling there are still going to be countless other guys ahead of him who will make All Star teams before he does.

          More than anything, I just don’t believe in roster duplicates. Each guy should have a specific role and skill set in order to fill a void and compliment his teammates. When you build a roster, you’re essentially piecing together a puzzle. If you have the same two pieces and one slot, how are they supposed to fit? It’s why I’ve also heavily petitioned for Chandler to be traded. Plus Stone is a perfect compliment to Lawson and I firmly believe he deserves a chance to secure the backup job before letting someone else have a shot.

      • Bryan

        I don’t really have a perception of him one way or the other. I don’t think I’ve ever seen him play. It’s just that even with Faried the Nuggets still got killed with offensive rebounds. Also, there don’t appear to be any 1st round prospects from his conference and maybe no draft picks. My feeling is that if you’re not from a big time conference and you’re basically the only NBA ready guy there your stats should be eye popping. And turning the ball over that much concerns me because everyone is faster and more athletic in the NBA. Honestly, in watching the Draft Express videos on both he and Moultrie they kind of look like a push to me.

        As far as Teague goes, I think his game is similar to Lawson’s except Teague is bigger and more explosive in terms of jumping ability but a little slower. Andre Miller is probably gone and Teague’s game seems like it would fit well with what Karl wants to do with his offense. And for the record, I actually like Marshall better too but I agree with you that he’ll be long gone.

  • junior

    I think for this upcoming draft we need a true shooting guard. Arron Afflalo is a great player, but if you look back when Ty Lawson was in college and when they won the tournament, Ty would always penetrate to the basket and kick it back out to Daniel Green or who ever else was open to make a 3 pointer. If we cant get a shooting guard, I would love to see Royce White on our team, I think he is a very tough player that would compliment Javell Mcgee’s tough defense.

  • zebort

    I like Royce White also, but he has shown a lack of consistency on defense and appears to need the ball in his hands on offense. On the other hand if he ends up with the Lakers, Boston or San Antonio, the Nuggets would regret not taking him.

  • Hoops

    The #20 pick is important and I feel Denver need a big with that pick, but their second pick is where they need a pure shooter and somehow Ujiri has to get either Doron Lamb or John Jenkins. They were a couple 3 pointers from beating the Lakers, but you have to expect the entire Western Conference to get better so you can’t sit still. This draft is paramount!!

  • Duuuuuuuude

    Royce White, Sullinger and Tony Wroten are my favoured options from the above list. If we select PJ III I will be extremely annoyed.

    • Duuuuuuuude

      Also Doron Lam needs to be on this board. I’d have it
      1A. White
      1B. Sullinger
      2. Doron Lamb
      3. Tony Wroten
      4. Terrence Jones
      5. Quincy Miller

  • DAN

    I don’t think we could pass up Sully if he was there. He would just be a perfect fit for us. He is athletic enough. It’s not like he has trouble getting up and down the court. But he could be a great combination with Faried and McGee. We need that low post scoring in the half court.

  • Gassen

    Why do we need a big so bad? Faried and McGee, two seven footers off the bench and a handful of guys who can play the four. We just need a pure shooter IMO. I like Jenkins and Barton barring something ridiculous slipping to us. I also love the idea of dealing chandler. Let’s be honest its Gunna take a while for us to be true title contenders. And what good does he really do us for the next few years vs his value coming into this year with the contract and how nice it would be to grab another pick in a draft like this

  • MongoSlade3000

    The two players I loved prior to the draft process beginning are now out of our range if we remain at 20. Ross and Waiters. That being the case, if either of the Jones boys, PJIII or Terrence, slips I’d be all over them. Not a fan of White or Sullinger (especially Sullinger). They’re just body types that are rarely successful in the increasingly long and athletic NBA. After that I’d swing for the fences with Miller a 6’11 shooter with crazy upside or Wroten a 6’6 PG with great vision and the ability to get to the bucket.

  • Duuuuuuuude

    PJ III is 6’11 but plays like he’s 6’1. 0.6 blocks per game is pathetic for someone with his frame and athleticism. Wroten is an option but his jumpshot is beyond broken (18% from 3 and 55% from charity stripe). White is athletic enough and his body type isn’t too disimilar to Lebron’s (although obviously he is no James) and Sullinger’s play, body and potential has the hint of Kevin Love to it.

    • Guy

      You can’t compare Sullinger to Love because Love is almost 7′ and has amazing range for someone that size. The only player with Sullinger’s body type and size to have success recently in the NBA are Zach Randolph and Big Baby Davis that I can think of. Sullinger won’t be able to dominate undersized front court college players in the NBA. Most teams small forwards are bigger and more athletic than Sullinger. The NBA is unkind to 6’6″-6’8″ guys who play below the rim.

      • Duuuuuuuude

        Kevin Love is 6’10 and Sullinger measured as 6’9 at the combine. Purely on body shape alone the following are similar size to Sullinger:
        Elton Brand, 6’9 , 254lbs
        Carlos Boozer, 6’9, 266lbs
        Paul Millsap, 6’8, 250lbs
        Glen Davis, 6’8, 289lbs
        David West, 6’8, 252lbs
        Boris Diaw, 6’8, 3000lbs
        Kevin Love, 6’10, 250lbs

        Do you class any of the forementioned players as being relatively successful in the NBA? Considering NBA teams often lie about height and weight there’s probably a good few more players who are a similar size.

        What’s just as important as size is how you use it. Even then, having an NBA skill is equally, if not more important. Sullinger can rebound, score in the post and has shown flashes of a perimeter game. What NBA skill does PJ III have? He rebounds OK, and he shoots OK from mid-range and doesn’t do much else.

        • MongoSlade3000

          I’m kind of an athlete snob so to speak. And while some of the guys you mentioned do share similar physical traits, most were elite at a particular skill. Love, Milsap: Rebounding. Diaw wasn’t fat until a few years ago and he was an elite passer. West was an above average athlete with an entirely different body type; i.e. broad shoulders, big arms vs. narrow shoulders, pear shape like Sullinger.

          So, when I think of the Nuggets and their tempo I think they need athletes and shooters. If they don’t re-up Andre Miller they will have one “need” position and depending on how they feel about Stone PG may not be the highest priority.

          That’s why I’d prefer guys that can run the floor and finish in transition or spot up and hit open shots. I feel both Jonses can do that. As well as Quincy Miller. Secondarily, we need someone that can create off the dribble. Right now Ty is the only guy. That’s why I like Wroten. I know his jumper is broken but, since Karl loves playing two PG’s at least have one of them be 6’6 and able to attack the basket.

        • Guy

          My bad on Sullingers height, I thought he was 6’8″. I did mention Glen Davis & Zach Randolph which I think more resemble Sullingers athletic ability from what I’ve seen. The players you have listed are all better athletically than Sullinger. Boris Diaw came into the league with the Hawks as a guard, Elton Brand was the #1 pick in 1999, David West came into the league at 235 lbs. and Milsap was drafted in the 2nd round.
          I’m not saying he won’t be a good player. If he drops to the end of the first round and we can get him by packaging the two 2nd round picks and moving up we should draft him. But at #20 I would rather take Nicholson who is more athletic and doesn’t have possible back issues.
          There’s plenty of lottery & 1st round flops you didn’t mention:
          Marcus Fizer
          Ike Diogu
          Corliss Williamson
          Robert “Tractor” Traylor
          Danny Fortson (Nuggets draft pick)
          Sean May
          Victor Alexander
          Michael Beasley
          Sheldon Williams
          Rodney White………….
          Just to name a few.

          • Ryan

            I wouldn’t say Fortson was a flop, he was a very good rebounder/post defender in the NBA for several years. Great, no, but not a flop. Also, Rodney White was much skinnier than the bulky, relatively short guys on the initial list with an entirely different game. Not sure he fits the list…

  • asdqqq

    Just looking at the stats for Nicholson could be seriously misleading for several reasons.
    1. He’s a 4th year senior. All the other guys being compared are underclassmen. Bigs especially are supposed to get better over time.
    2. He’s played at a lower level of competition than most of the other comparable guys.
    Unlike the Draft Express article, Hollinger has a model that tries to take into account things like that. Nicholson rates fairly poorly, coming in 16th among the bigs and rating in the range for a solid second round pick.

    That said, the reason for possible optimism with Nicholson is all the reports about shooting range and effort coming out of workouts, skills that he didn’t consistently show off during his college career. He didn’t attempt a 3 pointer his first 2 seasons. He made 6 of 23 his junior year. He made 4 his senior year before the final 10 games. His free throw percentage has never cracked 80%. Can he really shoot, or did he just go through a little hot streak at the end of his career? And his defense and effort were described by scouts as indifferent and inconsistent in his earlier years in college. But then he won defensive player of the year in his conference as a senior. Has he matured, or was he having a contract year?

    If the Nuggets think there is some good reason why he could be a substantially better player in the NBA than he was in college, then he might be worth a first round pick. I wouldn’t be disappointed if the Nuggets draft Nicholson because I trust that they will have done their homework on him.

  • http://Denverstiffs.comSlader Richard Greenslade

    I like Nicholson, and I agree with Kalen that the only one worth risking for above him is PJ3.

    I also dislike this notion that 22 year olds are somehow over the hill. True, at 19 many players haven’t shown their full potential, which usually means a team get to pay him millions for 2 or 3 years to get the better player they might have had immediately by drafting an older guy. In this respect, isn’t Nicholson>Quincy Miller?

    • Bryan

      This is true only if the older kid can play.

  • Tommy

    Remember Karl saying that in this draft stone would be a first round pick and hamilton top 10. Stone must be rated pretty high so i don’t think we will go after a point guard

  • FinazzAus

    Houston trade for the 18th pick and only give up basicully chase budinger. I know he played well last season but he was only a mid second round pick. If they get the 18th pick for him. We should easerly get a top 12 pick for chandler.